Gloomy Thursday
On this day of Thanksgiving, there are so many things for which La Cieca would like to give thanks. But enough about that. Here's one thing for which La Cieca would like to say, "Thanks, but no thanks."
Among the participants in this year's Macy's Thanksgiving parade: none other than The Beautiful Voice, or, as she is identified on NBC.com, "Renee Fleming, Grandma from the Big Apple Circus." Fleming will lip-synch "America the Beautiful," backed by an Army chorus and band. Also on hand will be Super Grover, SpongeBob SquarePants and Healthy Mr. Potato Head, who will perform scenes from Massenet's Cleopatre.
Among the participants in this year's Macy's Thanksgiving parade: none other than The Beautiful Voice, or, as she is identified on NBC.com, "Renee Fleming, Grandma from the Big Apple Circus." Fleming will lip-synch "America the Beautiful," backed by an Army chorus and band. Also on hand will be Super Grover, SpongeBob SquarePants and Healthy Mr. Potato Head, who will perform scenes from Massenet's Cleopatre.
POSTED at
12:39 AM
118 Comments:
I'm not really sure if I follow all the jokes, Cieca...but if someone with a decent voice is going to perform anything from Massenet's Cleopatre, I really want to know who and where because it is one of my FAVORITE operas.
Dear Tenore,
Take another big bite of pecan pie and laugh. (Don't choke.) Just be thankful on this day that we have a site like this where there is so much deLISHous humor at play.
As an exile in rural Flyoverville, I am sooo grateful for the Internet, for operacast.com, for the Met on Sirius, for the Audacity software that allows me to download and burn CDs of whatever I want. (And for my Aunt Dainty's pecan pies.)
j'ai froid... j'ai froid...
Poor Renee - unlike the Thanksgiving turkey, she gets stuffed and roasted all year round here.
Let's be positive and give thanks for the wonderful Met rebroadcasts that we are now getting.
I'm surprised I haven't seen many comments here about them. What a stupendous Verdi soprano the young Leontyne Price was! And the Verdi baritones that we had around in the 50's and 60's: Warren, MacNeil, Merrill. Wow.
I'll take Colzani's Tonio anyday over any I've heard since Milnes. Albanese sure enjoyed those high notes, didn't she? Can anyone come up with the right adjetive for Verrett's big scene in L'Assedio? And what can be said about the Sonnambula of the young Sutherland? Or Caballe and Cossotto in Norma? Did anyone notice that Farrell skipped the high C at the end of Cavalleria?
Happy Thanksgiving to all.
Unforunately La Couric is no longer with NBC, so we didn't get a chance to see Renaaay and Kateee on the split-screen, a la Bette in "A Stolen Life."
even gloomier news ... Betty Comden is dead. So sad. One of the true greats.
Renee was a thankfully short blight on one of my favorite activities - cooking Thanksgiving dinner while watching the parade. She sounded like crap. OTOH, Julie Andrews can now sustain some tones in her chest voice, and was her captivating self in her small segment. I'll take the vestiges of Julie over Renee any day.
verrett is sensational in L'assedio, for sure. too bad they didn't use the extended scena as in the one horne recorded. it was so short!
how could Cleopatre be your favorite opera? there's only one recording of the damn thing...
kaonohitan, I don't use recordings as a primary means to discover operas. Often times the best thing to do is to sit down at a piano and play through the score and discover it's beauties on your own. I am, however, familiar with the Cleopatre recording with Founillier conducting and think it's a marvellous one - Kathryn Harries does a beautiful rendition, as does the lyric soprano on the recording. Most of Massenet's music is simply outstanding, but unfortunately for him, the world seems content only knowing Manon, Werther, and an occasional Herodiade or Don Quichotte. It's a travesty - just as the fact that all the Donizetti that anyone knows are the wretched scores of L'elisir and Don Pasquale and the magnificent Lucia. Of course, L'elisir and Pasquale are beautiful operas, but they are trifles compared to so many of his other 70+ operas. Thankfully, in Europe, 3 of his 5 or 6 English Queens are still regularly portrayed on stage (keep in mind that there are TWO operas titled 'Elisabetta' by Donizetti) and the great Lucrezia Borgia score is still produced often and is beginning to make more appearances in this country. But for all of Donizetti and Massenet's geniuses (amongst so many others), the American public (I cannot speak so freely for other countries, but I imagine the scenario is not too different) is content with having the same belaboured operas shoved down their throats time and time again. I think it's high time to give much of the 'standard' repertoire a well-deserved rest (unless opera houses are going to start performing them with exquisite set designs and even more exquisite singing - instead of every regional opera house putting on mediocre productions of Bohemes and Traviatas and Carmens just because they are monetary draws for the lesser informed publics that attend them) and we need to start bringing other great masterpieces by all the composers - from Mozart and Gluck to Leoncavallo and Verdi and Strauss - into the attention of singers and opera lovers around the world.
It would be a JOY if the Met were to put on an opera like Massenet's Cleopatre (with one of the most sensual and elegant of all portrayals of the great queen's death) with someone like Olga Borodina or Dolora Zajick, Hvorostovsky or Pape (or a better suited bass-bartione since that's what the role of Marc-Antoinie is), a soprano like Nicole Cabell and a tenor like Giordani (who I think would sound beautiful in this part, despite the fact that it is small, it is gorgeous writing), and someone fabulous to direct and stage it - who isn't going to throw in all sorts of avant-garde and nonsense on the stage - but create a glorious world for the characters to exist in, with interesting staging that doesn't inhibit the singing, yet captures the imaginations of the audience to create a truly memorable and exciting operatic experience!! And thus - we have the box office draws and the exposure of a forgotten Massenet work with top quality singing and orchestra and a fabulous production. (I unfortunately can't contribute a name of a director because when I watch operas, the director is the last person that I pay attention to - although one could see Gian-Carlo Del Monaco do something of interest with the subject matter).
I agree with ITDCS, why is it that so few donizetti operas are performed? They aren't especially long or complex and are full of great drama and melody, so what's not to love? Although i know we don't have singers like callas, caballe, and sills to perform the title roles in anna bolena or roberto d., there are some decent sopranos who certainly can do justice to the role, ironically most of whom the MET passes up. i.e. antonacci. As for Massenet, it is so unfortunate that he has been even more neglected than donizetti. At least there are great recordings of lucrezia, the tudor operas, etc. but there are hardly any recordings of massenet operas besides manon and werther, save for a thais or herodiade. Is there any explanation for this? From what i've heard of the rarely performed massenet operas (navarraise, esclarmonde, cleopatre etc.), these are quality works! Is it really possible that his other works are really that bad?!
Betty and Adolph are together now and can write shows for Kelly and O'Conner and the other angels forever, and Anita O'Day is with Krupa and Stanwyck doing Drum Boogie thru eternity. The thought of Renee lip syncing gave me a sudden vision of the Archies and Milli Vanilli (Sugar sugar Rennee girl, you know it's true)
In the Met Encyclopedia a NY critic about 1910 said the Massenett's music had all the emotion of a telephone switchboard girl. JM makes me think of the kind of music Charles Kane liked.
answering scifisci's question, one of the big stumbling blocks to the Met's performing more Donizetti, besides the dearth of women who can handle bel canto technique in a big house, is James Levine. Because this repetoire features the singer and the drama, and the orchestral writing is basically accompaniment, he's not able to do amazing things with the orchestra like he can in Strauss, Wagner, blahblahblah and he gets bored. That's the strange thing about him that doesn't get much play - he's (for no reason I can name) thought of as a "singer's conductor", and he's really not - for him it's orchestra first and formost, and the lack of bel canto vocal vehicles at the Met are the result.
Of course, having Renee and Netrebko doing much of the "bel canto styling" in the house in the next few years is going to be just as much of a problem as Levine.
Let me just get this out of the way, there is nothing wrong with Netrebko. There, I've said it Sure, she's no Joan Sutherland, but they said Sutherland is no Lily Pons. I'm getting really tired of this kind of needless negativity. She's a fine singing actress, a real stage animal, more of a kunstdiva than a stimmdiva, but that doesn't mean she can't pull off an Amina or an Adina or an Elvira. And no, her coloratura isn't perfect, but neither was Mirella Freni's, and that didn't perclude her from doing some fantastic bel canto work. For that matter, the same can be said of Maria Callas. I guess I'm just tired of everyone bitching about her when there really isn't much room for complaint.
Fleming, however, I cannot defend (these days anyway) except to say that I've heard worse.
adendum:
All that being said, I still wouldn't want to see her as Maria Stuarda.
How about gheorghiu in bel canto? Am i the only one who wished she did more of it when she was younger? To my ears, her coloratura was certainly good enough, definitely more natural than say, fleming's warblings, although unlike fleming, i never thought gheorghiu had anything above a D-flat, but who knows. Either way, i always wanted to hear her as anna bolena or even amina/elvira (if she practiced enough). Those are no more of a stretch than her Tosca i think, but alas, she has chosen her path and i'm sure one day she'll do bel canto, though god forbid i'm sure it'll be norma.
As for Netrebko...I saw some of her as Manon and I really enjoyed it. She has all the purely vocal qualities covered--Sizeable voice of beautiful timbre, clear high notes and a decent if smudged coloratura. I just wish she would learn to characterize more with her voice and be more subtle in her coloring. Her violetta could have been much much more than it was!
baritenor: To think that anyone said sutherland was no lily pons, how aweful!
We have the following issues at hand:
A) Netrebko has a lovely instrument, and a wonderful predisposition it seems for dramatic integrity...the problem with Netrebko is inconsistency in her singing and in the roles which she chooses and is hired to perform. What reasons are behind this (money, sheer musical ignorance, management, publicity, combinations of these and other possibilities) cannot be said by many and are known to very few. She is still a 'young' singer, her career is 'young' and she is endeavoring to sing repertoire that does not suit her vocally very well. Alas, Bartoli seems to be the one person who was able to capitalize and launch into stardom singing Despina - a role that would fit Netrebko's voice much more than Violetta or Mimi.
It isn't to say that she would never in her life sing these larger bel canto roles...but if we look at people like Scotto and Freni and Gruberova and Caballe and Devia and Gedda and Kraus...they all took time for their voices and careers to develop singing the things that suited them best until they reached various points in their vocal and dramatic abilities and level of fame, which then has allowed them to take more daring excursions into other repertoire that they grew into or had acquired the necessary maturity and skills to successfully portray characters and sing roles that weren't naturally in their vocal capacity. This is the danger that lies ahead in Netrebko's career - along with Villazon.
B) Gheorghiu in bel canto would never work because she refuses to sing in a sylistically correct manner and she often lacks a true sense of legato in her singing - and all bel canto singing is based on legato and style - yes, even ALL the fast notes: in reality, they are just tiny pieces of a much larger phrase. Coloratura must be approached with the same support and sense of line that one would apply in a long sweeping melody of Bellini or Puccini or Mozart.
Gheorghiu - as per the famous argument with Solti when rehearsing the Desdemona aria - refuses to utilize portamenti in her singing, even when the portamento is specifically written by the composer - in bel canto vocal music (up through late Verdi as well), a slur between two notes or two syllables represents a difinitive portamento. This is completely different from a 'scoop.'
To me, it seems that AG would best put her talents to singing more French opera - I have to admit that I have begun to enjoy her Manon and the video of her singing "Pleurez mes yeux" on Youtube is simply astounding! Watch it - you can see that even SHE was surprised that she sang it so well. The sad thing is that she then proceeds to attempt the Habanera where she doesn't sing a single note in tune. But I do believe that had AG (and RF as well) began their careers with more bel canto roles and waited to indulge in more lyric and spinto roles as they matured in career and voice, there would probably be less inconsistencies and generally 'unaccepted' idiosyncracies in their singing at this point.
C)There are some outstanding artists right now who are completely capable of singing the hell out of many of these great bel canto roles. Of the most obvious are the two most famous European coloratura sopranos - Gruberova and Devia - both consummate artists and true virtosi - always consistent and sounding incredible (just watch the chronology of their careers on Youtube!) - and both undeservedly slighted at larger careers in this country. Why the Met let them go is beyond me! Other singers perfectly capable of singing this literature are Antonacci, Pendachanksa, Desiree Rencantore, and if only she would stay in her appropriate repertoire and stop trying to be a lyrico-spinto, Ruth Ann Swenson would be fantastic in something like Lucrezia Borgia or Maria Padilla!
I also now plenty of up-and-coming young sopranos who fit perfectly well in that sort of repertoire - but the chances of them ever getting to explore it and feeling truly at home with it are rather slim should they have careers this side of the atlantic - the same applies for voices like mine and Lawrence Brownlee and JDF, and the Interpolator - all this great repertoire is performed in Europe and South America and Japan.
The singers are out there - and they are great in their own right - there is no need to wish for Callas or Sutherland or Sills because we have singers whose names can stand on their own - they do exist out there - I know because I have seen and heard and know so very many!!
D) balabanov, sadly I think you are absolutly correct in your assessment about programming at the Met. Perhaps some of it will change now with Gelb at the helm and with Levine spending so much time up in Boston. The sad thing is that in the works of Meyerbeer, late Donizetti, Massenet, Saint-Saens, Boieldieu, serious Rossini, Weber, late Salieri (particularly his French operas), Respighi, Leoncavallo, Montemezzi, and plenty of other composers - had all given a tremendous importance to the orchestra in their operas - especially people like Rossini and Boieldieu who, respectively, began to increase the importance of the orchestra's role in Italian and French opera and strove to include a larger variety of orchestral colors and effects to better reflect and support the drama and emotions on stage!
I tell you all - there is SO much wonderful music out there and so many amazing singers that are overlooked for one reason or another. The industry has become so focused on appearances and politics and money and bs that the important things - the foundations of what make opera the greatest art form of humankind because of it's incorporation of drama, design, instrumental and vocal music, the written word, fashion, hair, make-up, engineering, history, literature, and the human experience - have all been over-looked or are exploited to such a degree that they have lost their value.
I say: Put the fat girl on stage if she can sing and act better than the skinny girl - make a pretty dress for her - give her a beautiful set and a good orchestra and a brilliant conductor - and let it be about art, about music, about drama, and about how music and opera touches and moves our souls and spirits!
Il tenore-Grazie, comunque Consistency is what? Was Callas consistent, DiStefano, Corelli? I know who is consistent Renee Fleming. Marilyn Horne. Will they be remembered or will it be those people who brought fire despite 'inconsistencies'?
Netrebko has spark That is what I like about her. (This is not from recordings-I have seen her live several times!)My beloved Aprile is far from 'consistent' but I will listen to her 20 times before hearing Renee et al.
As for Lily Pons-She sucked. That portrait of her in the Met gallery holding that bird makes me laugh as the bird probably had more oomph in its voice than her! Yeah I said it. Roberta Peters too! Listening to LP's mad scene makes me want to stab myself before she could do anything to herself!!!!
You like Devia. LOVE her Do you have that live Sonnambula with Canonici? It is fab.!
See what I think by clicking my name.
I'm sorry, baritenor, but I think there is plenty of room for complaint about Netrebko. Yes, she is a stage animal, but that's where it ends. I've seen her live in three different roles and the Traviata dvd. To me, her coloratura is sloppy, there's no nuance, no pianissimo, no trill. Also, her dark tone is not to my taste either in most roles. The only time her voice works for me is in the Kirov recordings from the mid-90s.
Newinnyc: Inconsistency concerning pitch and musicality, cleanliness of phrases and good resonance/placement. Of course, all singers have their offf-nights, illnesses, etc.
Di Stefano was dreadful to listen to for most of his career. What he sounded like on his earliest recordings is almost inhuman it's divine! But then he got carried away, started to spread and push and destroyed what was probably the greatest tenor voice ever.
Callas too, for all her faults, certainly can't be compared with anyone - she was such a unique creature and her abilities - dramatic, musical and vocal - are such a rare combination that the world is able to forgive her for out of tune and badly placed wobbly singing at times - but it was only because she had sang extremely WELL during a large portion of her career.
I would not call Millo's singing inconsistent. Watch the numerous videos of her on Youtube and her fabulous recordings - it is all the same voice, all with the same beautiful tone, exquisite musicality and arching legato - whether she was singing Ballo or Pirata - she still always shows exemplary artistry.
I completely agree with you about Lily Pons. I made the horrible mistake many years ago of buying that 2 CD set put forth by Columbia Records where it had a little booklet sewn into the folio with pictures and biographical information of the Pons. The only thing I ever liked of hers that I was really impressed by listening to, was this random vocal arrangmenet with jazz orchestra of Strauss' Blue Danube Waltz - she does do some impressive staccato and altissimo work there - but alas, there we have it, all staccato and no substance - thank God because that vibrato was awful!
And my Devia - how I adore her! I wish there were more recordings of her! I can think of dozens of cd's with other sopranos where the coloratura soprano SHOULD have been either Devia or Gruberova or Anderson!!
I hope to be able to hear La Devia and La Gruberova live one day soon!
I will be on the look out for that Sonnambula.
Tenore- Saw Devia do Lucia. The voice live is really THAT spectacular.
Try to get a look at Pavarotti Plus when Devia and Hampson sing 'Pronta io son' It is what opera is about. Tom's okay but HER!!!! Fantastic
I regret never seeing Gruberova. Her Entfuhrung with Solti is...well, there are no words.
Would love to know what you and others think of Malfitano...
The diva we all, well, some of us, love to hate, Renee Fleming, is on the cover of the November issue of Gramophone magazine. Towards the end of the article, La Fleming seems to target forums like this one:
"..."Haunted Heart" caused a predictable flurry of carping from internet chat groups...The internet has caused us to be more scrutinized because we can't go anywhere in the world without being commented upon(duh!). If I'm singing in a small town, then everybody knows about it. However, in the chatrooms there are people who find it useful to disintegrate the most popular stars (is she conceited or what?). There are people who love to be outrageous (I think that's you La Cieca!)who are really mean to me, and then there are others who get a buzz out of coming to someone's rescue. If that's the only scandal about me then I'm happy about it. That said, I don't want to know what is being said about me. I'm too quick to take on negative opinions and start to believe them. Well, poor Renee, she really does read us! One advise: sing the arias the way they were written, and maybe you won't get too much pie thrown in your beautiful face and voice!
I doubt seriously that Renee or any other well-known opera singer goes anywhere near the opera blogs or forums. I certainly wouldn't if I were them.
Newinnyc-
I can really take or leave Gruberova. Some of her performances really have put me off, but then again I've heard her in some really fabulous stuff.
Malfitano...okay, she used to be good, maybe even great. But my memories of her are forever tainted by a horrendous Carmen in Los Angeles in 2004. I shudder just thinking about it. She was way past her vocal prime (the Habernara was painful) and was about thirty years too old and 100 pounds too heavy for La Carmencita. It was laughable.
Heard Netrebko slither her way thru Amina this afternoon. Vibrato rate all over the map depending on how hard she drove the voice, or undersang as she did in places. Intonation just as wayward. I knew we were in for trouble when she got to the "balzar" section of sovra il sen, but nothing could have prepared us for how bad it really was.... NOT EVEN REMOTELY CLOSE!! Occasionally one out of four notes resembled a pitch, the rest was party record stuff. Never heard a worse rendtition ever. She tried an e flat....flat beng the operative word, and unfortunatele straight as John Wayne and Donald Rumsfeld combined. Another note for the party record. Pincherama. Ouch.
Puritani is going to be scarey....if she doesn't cancel.
Hopefully the production was updated so in the sleepwalking scene she could wear a satin crotchless teddy and a nightgown that just happened to fall open....
This is not the subject, but anyone is hearing tonight´s performance of "Tosca" with Millo? She is fantastic and in very good voice. So far from New York, my boyfriend and me are shouting our bravos. And this is a tenor who really holds the high B flats and the B! At least, a real Tosca
Oh thank god I tuned in in in time for Visse d'arte.
Millo was fine until the final phrases of "Vissi d'arte"....then she fell apart. Pity...as the rest of her singing was very good...on pitch...and her C's were great.She let the aria defeat her.
if it's any consolation, no one this season has been able to sing the aria - Guleghina and Gruber were both horrible in it every single performance. Tonight Millo was in better voice than I've heard for quite awhile, but it's still a shame what has happened to that sound - you never know what you are going to get above the staff, and while some phrases are idomatic and lovely, others barely register or wobble like crazy. she is a completely different singer from the youtube Pirata girl, and not in the good way.
I'll be seeing Tosca on Tuesday, from the Family Circle. I made a fool of myself at the ticket window, because after years of saving to go to Covent Garden I refused to believe that the clerk was saying 'fifteen' and not 'fifty' dollars... I'm thrilled, having followed this site for years, to happen across such an auspicious time for my first visit to NYC.
There's so much in this thread that fascinates me that I don't know where to start- and apologies that a relative newbie to the blog side of things should post something so long. Feel free to scroll past.
I'll start with the slightly controversial part- I can't agree with the prevailing opinion that Donizetti and Massenet are underperformed. To start with Gaetano- The bel canto repertoire generally leaves me cold. Tonic, dominant, tonic, dominant, crescendo, cabaletta, high E. Endlessly. Rossini I love, Bellini had his moments, Donizetti- don't get it. And I don't see how anyone can rhapsodize about the drama. The libretti are hack poetry, the emotions vulgarly 'theatrical' with not even a nod to truth. It's 'Sunset Beach' with a conductor. Next time you hear a Donizetti opera you don't know, try singing along with how you think the melody is going to develop and with what you guess the rhyme word is going to be. It's a great parlour game because you always win.
Massenet is a different one for me. I can accept the talent and artistry, but somehow he leaves me cold. A bit too lush for me, I think, like eating a whole box of Turkish Delight in one sitting.
On the singers, a couple of things strike me. The Despina suggestion for Netrebko is spot on. I've seen her at CG and it's a fine voice, a decent technique and she's a good stage animal, but her 'Giunse alfin... Deh vieni' on that DG recital is head, shoulders and torso above anything else I've heard her do. A Freni/ Popp/ Cotrubas career, with all the pacing that implies, would do her so many more favours at the moment.
The other thing that leapt out at me (apart from the Fleming bile (I don't like her mannerisms any more than you do, but I genuinely believe she is serious about what she does. Talent without taste is a very common little gag of fate's, so for god's sake leave the poor woman alone) is the hint at the old singer/size debate. I think the time is coming for a separation of productions and houses: if you don't care about what's supposed to be the truth of the drama, you can have your colossi with the great voices at *this* theatre here, if not, come to *this* one, where we're serious enough about opera to make it credible. Voigt's instrument knocks Schwanewilms' into a cocked hat, but having seen the CG Ariadne, their decision was absolutely spot on. The production would have been absurd dramatically if Voigt had played it as she then was, and if that's the case you might as well go concert or semi staged. And note what she's done since.
Yes, opera is primarily a musical art form. But it's a dramatic one too, vitally. As a balding 33 year old actor, I'd be laughed out of the room if I went in to audition for Romeo, and quite right too. There's more leeway in opera, particularly where age is concerned, and quite right too. But let's not kid ourselves that the ability to ride the crescendi and colour the emotions VOCALLY are enough to make a serious dramatic experience. That's selling this great art form way, way short.
Sorry again for the presumptuously long post.
armerjaquino: Welcome to Parterre and, though we may disagree on certain points and agree on others, you seem to be intelligent and well informed, which is something truly appreciated.
If I may interject a thought, and it is certainly not directed towards you, but merely as another perspective of the operatic art:
Much evidence seems to suggest that today's worldly society and it's impositions on the operatic art form are in part to why so many of us feel that the art form is suffering bouts of decay - sort of a double-edged sword in many respects, rather.
There are many who have brought the to light that the fact that our modern society is too harsh in many respects on theatrical art in general in society's thirst for realism as a result of the great technological strides in TV and Cinema, to name but the two largest and most easily exemplified subjects.
In TV we have seen such a surge for "Reality Shows" and though we may still enjoy many a chuckle from sitcoms - it is now the TV Drama that primarily holds the tv audience's attention. Dramas and stories that revolve around scenarios and characters that seem as though they could exist just outside ones front door. And there is certainly nothing wrong with it!
The same applies in movies in the sense that regardless of subject matter, audiences tend to dismiss movies and cinematography and special/graphic effects if they are 'unrealistic' or 'fake looking' or not well constructed so that the average viewer can pick up on all the loopholes in the plot overlooked by the screenplay authors and directors. Even if the subject matter of the movie is one of fantasy and fiction - we as an audience want so much for it to real so that we may forget ourselves in the theatre and experience the action and the fantasy as though it were real.
This attitude, though certainly with many merits for the mentioned mediums and various others, may be one of the reasons why so much of opera is either disliked or misunderstood by many listeners or destroyed by many overly creative stage directors. To simplify my point = Let's take an opera like Sonnambula, for example. By modern standards, it really is a dumb and ridiculous plot - a whole opera about some orphan sleepwalker who's betrothed to some jealous and stubborn local Casanova who has a slut running after him and suspects some debonair noblemen who is neither villianous or heroic of de-purifying his fiance. The poetry isn't the most magnificent and the story line is rather lame. But the music is divine and the emotions that Bellini wrote into them are equally sincere and moving. So here we have a 'dry' bel canto opera that lacks in any aspect of realism whatsoever - it is a subject virtually unrelatable to most people in the modern age, especially those who would actually be in attendence of watching the opera - most modernizations of it would only cause it to lose what little credibility it has because certainly such a scenario would be laughable in a modern urbanist society.
But to the public who listened to Sonnambula before TV and Radio and Motion Pictures...to them it was fantasy - and the lines of reality could be fuzzy. One could watch Donizetti's Anna Bolena and not care about historical accuracy or if all the plot and character lines make total sense and blend seamlessly and logically together!
At the time that these operas were being performed - it was enough for composers and public and musicians alike to be touched emotionally by the energy and intesity of a great artist's singing. It mattered much less the appearance of everything. It seems that in today's society, many strive to make three dimensional live theatrical art into what they expect and are used to in two dimensional pre-taped and edited mechanical art. This is where much of the conflict lies, I believe.
If we go into an opera expecting the sets and the costumes and the plot to transport us into another world by visual stimulation - we thus prohibit the music and the artists (both on stage, on podium and in the pit) from allowing us to be transported aurally. So much of modern society is unwilling to accept things as they are or as mere elements of fanstasy and fiction because we are so absorbed in witnessing real life and the recreation of real life events and situations - because it is something we can more easily recognize and relate to.
Bel canto opera was not ever about the plot or the acting - it was about the music, the vocal abilities both technical and interpretative and the individual artist's (both singer and composer) ability to move people through music and truth in the words that were being sung. The truth can absolutely exist in these less-realistic stage pieces...but it is an interesting notion to think that perhaps in our current day attempts at 'updating' and 'modernizing' many operas...we do a grave injustice to so many of them - trying to make logical sense out of many illogical situations and create effective synapses that connect all points and moments of the opera together - since so many of them were created for their own time and not for a society as driven for perfection as ours.
For those of us who are singers and have been involved in 'updated' operatic productions - I can't tell you how many moments in EACH production where a director had a brilliant idea of making sense out of something that could have been considered a loophole or of inconsequence...and made a huge deal to the artists that this particular idea was connected to various other ideas in their conception of the opera and that this particular idea is so essential to their vision of the piece. And do you know what? 99% of the time - the audience NEVER even knows about it - and if the do perchance to catch onto it or witness it in some way, shape, or form, they generally do not understand it or put it together with the rest of the action. The list of moments like this in my short career could go on for pages and pages! And I'm sure if you think about it - you ALL can think of productions where you saw something that made no sense to you at all.
So perhaps it is our modern aesthetic tastes that in many cases (all of us culpable to some degree) prevents us from being able to enjoy many aspects of the operatic and theatrical arts?
I would implore that those truly interested should read the writings and letters of composers like Gluck, Salieri, Mozart, Beethoven, Bellini, Donizetti, Massenet, Bizet, Puccini, Verdi, Wagner...none of these composers ever watched a movie or a tv...yet each and every one of them strove to create moments in their operas - regardless of how poor the libretti may have been (and most were aware - also many didn't have a choice in the libretto and even more had to compose before ever having read through the complete libretto - another explanation for dramatic inconsistencies) - of truth and veritable human emotion and thought. And furthermore, each of them demanded that their performers take as much care with each word and each phrase as they themselves did when setting and writing them to imbue as honest, truthful, and real of emotion and energy as possible so that their music would be empowered to have the necessary effects on the listeners. These were men and women who never knew of such technologies as we do, and yet, were able to portay characters and convince audiences in ways that few alive today can speak of.
I really ought to go to bed... oh, what the hell. Sunday tomorrow.
itdcs- thank you for your gracious welcome and such a passionate and well argued response to my bletherings. Just to correct one potential misapprehension, when I talk about 'truth' I'm not referring to some kind of Strasbergian hypernaturalism. Of course opera is not there to reflect what's going on in the apartment next door (unless, if your apartment is like mine, the opera is Il Tabarro or Wozzeck) and heaven save us from the reality tv-ification of the form.
But THEATRICAL truth, now, there's the thing. My last stage job was as Horatio in Hamlet. It was, as it happens, a modern dress production, but fortunately not a naff or tricksy one. I think the requirements of a Shakespeare play are a decent analogy here, when we talk of naturalism vs truth; as Horatio I had to watch my best friend die, and were that to happen to me in 'real life' I very much doubt that my immediate response would be in iambic pentameter. BUT, despite the heightened nature of the form, there's enough there to allow the performer to bring oceans of his or her personal experience, raw and true and real, to what they have to say. And of course, to play Shakespearean verse properly you do have to SING it to a certain extent. That being the case- and flagrantly crossbreeding two arguments together- I'd much rather see a credibly sexy Eboli tearing up O Don Fatale with the odd dodgy note than a 60 year old heifer tootling through 'Alfin son tua'...
Or, to give another example of how we maybe need to apply some of the disciplines of theatre to our operatic music making, let's take the end of Cosi. The C major concertato tells us that we are having a happy ending. But (post Freud, etc etc etc, yadda yadda yadda) HOW can you sweep act 2 of that opera under the carpet, with all its passion and eroticism between the 'wrong' couples, and conveniently pair everyone off the way they were before? Surely the exciting challenge is to find a way to honour both the C major AND the upheavals both couples have faced? THAT's what I mean by truth, a satisfying blend of music, situation and interpretation. And, of course, if you have, say (forgive the time-travel element) Margaret Price as Fiordiligi and , say, Elina Garanca as Dorabella you'd be unable to avoid thinking 'but surely they both fancy HER?', never mind the gulf in vocal quality between them. On a lighter note, this was the problem with my first Don Carlo, at CG when I was 15. I couldn't understand why the women were fighting over Dennis O'Neill when Gino Quilico was standing right there...
Another giant post. I'll be less verbose in future, I promise. And so to bed.
AMEN!!! Years ago, I myself was not considered for certain roles because I was 20 lbs. overweight. (Provincial houses are far crueler than A-list houses, trust me...) Still, in this day and age, there really is no excuse for obesity. When I was singing in decent houses, there was ample time to hit the gym, go for a walk, etc. Far more than with my 9-5 gig! Like Amerjaquino, I learned it early. Rita Hunter was Norma to Troyanos' Adalgisa. Adding insult to injury, Hunter did not have the benefit of Sutherland's stunning costumes and was left with basically a brown sack. Could anyone wonder why Pollione had dumped Norma for Adalgisa, with Troyanos, draped in vestal virgin white Grecian finery, the definition of Goddess?
La Voigt - for all her reasons - made the correct choice for herself. Like it or not, her weight loss has opened the doors for her dramatically. With Mattila soon to take on Isolde, I feared that Debbie would be shut out simply due to size. The clip of her Salome is proof enough. Now her greatest work surely lies ahead of her.
As for the Netrebko thread, one look at the clip of Dessay's Lucia shows proof of real artistry. Both as a singer and actress, the Russian is left in the dust. Still, I yearn to hear Dessay's Pamina! On her Mozart disc, I find her "Ach, ich fuhl's" to be the finest track.
Color! That is what Netrebko has. That edge that makes it exciting. Dessay is wonderful but does not have the color. People are willing to forgive some things if there is a certain 'rawness' to the voice. It is that edge that draws people in. Sutheraland for all of her perfect execution had an edge, Callas, Scotto etc etc Not saying Annie is of that ilk yet but I am trying to illustrate a point. I like her LOTS. but I am scared she will do heavier things than she ought a al Freni-Karajan collaborations.
Of course there is no excuse for obesity in general - and it's certainly a shame for people who are unable to do anything about it for one medical reason or another. But to exclude top notch singing because someone is a little thick around the edges or too short or too tall or what-have-you is really unacceptable in and of itself.
It's interesting that so many opera-goers look at opera in the ways you both, amerjaquino and gordonsgirl, stated: confused that a certain character would be aroused by the less attractive portrayer of their counterpart.
Martina Arroyo always joked about how when she would sing Tosca with Sherrill Milnes, that she'd always sit there and look at whatever short, fat tenor she was singing with - then look at Milnes - and think to herself "well hell, who wants him when I can have sexy Scarpia - we'll just end the opera at the torture scene and live happily ever after."
Perhaps, for myself, I am able to just accept the plot and action for what it is - whether I agree with it or not (ie Butterfly waiting around 3 years for Pinkerton - Bitch, MOVE ON!) and allow good singing and the composer to be the things that convince me. I do find that very interesting: "I couldn't understand why the women were fighting over Dennis O'Neill when Gino Quilico was standing right there."
Of course, in Cosi, that is the dark side of the comedy - neither Da Ponte nor Mozart ever provided us with an actual answer about who ends up with whom! That is something left completely in the hands of directors. The C Major is only returned to because the opera as a whole has been placed in C Major - whatever the reasons none shall ever know - but there have been many good informative studies about the key relationships and progressions in the operas of Mozart - they are extremely well thought out - and generally, it was customary at that time (as in Symphonies) to begin and end a work in the same key.
Mr. Tenore coloratura superba:
You might want to hire an editor to edit and manage your epistle-length posts. You'd be surprise to find out how writing brief posts actually say more than writing in paragraphs. Anyway, I like what you wrote about Gheorghiu and Fleming. You were spot on.
No offense, Newinnyc, but have you heard Dessay live? Granted, i've yet to hear Netrbeko live but, judging from TV and DVDs, her voice is all one color - dark and smoky. Though lovely, it never changes. She reminds me of Suzanne Mentzer. When I heard her Dorabella over the Met broadcast, there was no smile to the character. What a surprise when I saw the telecast, which was glorious! Her face was wonderfully expressive, causing one to ignore the voice being generally one color.
I did see Dessay live - Morgana in LCO's "Alcina." The woman acted with every part of her being, including her voice. In a wonderful cast, which included Fleming's Alcina, Dessay blew everyone off the stage. Her aria which opened Act III remains particularly remarkable, especially for the incredible shadings. Simply breathtaking...
And while Netrebko's vocal color can be interesting dark when she leaves it alone, her entire problem these days is due to her overdarkened, manufactured, hooded sound - it's not normal, it's not healthy, and it's why she's been a vocal disaster in her recent attempts at bel canto and French opera, which were obviously contracted back when her voice was fresher and not nearly as badly produced. It is virtually impossible for her to sing in tune with clean fioritura, correct ornamentation (especially trills) and notes in alt when she is yelling with a voice that back in the throat. She can't even do the simple turns in the Brindisi in Traviata - much less Sempre Libera, and the Manon excerpt from youtube posted here is just a mess of screaming and thick, non-flexible vocal production. It would be one thing if she was Sally-who-cares singing in regional houses, but she is going from major house to major house, stinking up this repetoire, and no critic (outside of us) seems to be holding her feet to the fire. Of course, the likes of Anne Midgette as a vocal critic brings on a whole nutther mess...
Oh yes, I've missed this forum. What a great bit of conversation you've all been endulging in. ITDCS always has great stuff to say, and a lot of the rest of you do too. I may not agree with it all, but I must say I love Balabanov's last comment re: Netrebko.
Regarding Gheorghiu, I can't stand her coloratura, and though I haven't analyzed the individual facets of her singing like portamenti, I have always been a big fan of her lyrico-dramatic stuff such as her Puccini and some of her Verdi. Her french is more passable than most these days, and I love the colors I hear in her voice as well as the drama I hear in it.
Fleming will always be subject to criticism from me as long as she continues to sing with such horrible mannerisms. She truly was a great singer once, so it is quite sad.
ITDCS states it quite right when he says there is so much talent out there that can really sing. Too often I see that talent being passed up for reasons that we've all heard of. I don't know what the formula is to surpassing these obstacles, but I will do my damndest to make it through to a career. Thank God I've still got time before I have to start. Until then, I will enjoy parterre for its controversy, witty banter, and dirt on the dirty world of opera.
If only the rest of the world were as passionate as the majority of you...
Scifisci--
I think so many Donizetti operas aren't performed for 2 reasons: 1) we are very close-minded in reinstating old works and too thrifty to produce new productions for these shelved works, 2) name one really great coloratura that can sing all that shit? I mean, does the Met have a house coloratura, and please don't say Netrebko. I am sorry but I don't hear great coloraturas sopranos the likes of Sills in her hay day or Sutherland in hers. The last great coloratura we produced was Anderson and she wasn't well received after a while due to her crazy antics. I think we, the audience, was so accustomed to coloratura perfection that stage directors and conductors don't want to take the gamble on subjecting us to anything less than the standard that was set by the greats. After all, coloratura sopranos are one of two ways, good or bad. There really is no inbetween for us.
ITDCS--I say bring on Belisario and Lucrezia and all the dang Queens. I am glad Pasquale is making a comeback. Donizetti is great. Or how about Bellini's La Straniera? What about that one? Belisario and Straniera are beautiful. Something to think about.
I have to post one more comment. What in the heck is Fleming upset about people's opinion on this website? She should be thanking us b/c at least we gave her food for thought. It's obvious that no one else is giving her good sound advice as far as her rep is concerned. I hope she reads this every night before she goes to bed. The majority of the people on here adore here and that is why we write this junk about her all the time b/c we don't want her destroying what is so easily hers, the coveted position of America's Opera Darling. I don't know where she got off saying that anyone on this website hates her or whatever. That is absurd. Everyone adores her and that is precisely why they bitch about her vocalism and her technique and worry with her over these things. She cannot live in an oblivious world in which she is unaware that her adoring public is unhappy with how she is interpreting things. It's a double edged sword for her, on the one hand she is praised for her interpretations but when she gets it wrong it is really wrong, and it seems that is all anyone focuses on. How many portrayals of characters has she nailed down and put her stamp on? Good grief. Rusalka, Manon, the Countess, Marschallin, the Countess in Capriccio, basically if it's Strauss and Mozart she can do it and do it better than anyone. I adore her in the French rep. Loved Thais, Herodiade, and Manon. She's a magnificent artist but don't live in a world in which she thinks that she isn't subjected to artistic opinion. After all, these same skeptics were also the first to adore her. She has ruled the American opera scene for how many years now? Opera Chanteuse thanks for updating us on the article.
ITDCS--I adore you. You always say what I'm thinking exactly.
Pacenoia--I agree completely on Netrebko as Amina, why?
Gordon-Heard Dessay twice. Loved her but the spark...?
Balbanov-Vocal health...Don't tell callsorphan that about his mother.
So what if you shoot your wad, if it is exciting, sing on! All I know is when I went to hear AN sing it was exciting. I felt like I was in those old recordings from La Scala with the crowd screaming , etc. FOR OPERA PEOPLE! Not Bono and U2! Just like when I go to see my Aunt Aprile tomorrow. It is part of the thrill. It is that whole package of singing opera that brings people back. A willingness to forgive certain imperfections if there is, sorry to repeat myself, the spark! Now I am not saying be a sell out. However, with whom would you rather sit next to at the opera, the enthusiast who is taken by the WHOLE package; drama, music, singing, a buzzy crowd or the old bitter queen who tut-tuts everything saying, "Her trill was off and I heard Sutherland do it better!"
You decide.
Well said newinnyc - there's nothing wrong with nice packages :)
Gordonsgirl - your statement "no excuse for obesity" totally sucks!
Dear Itdcs - you came close too - but escape by a whisker because you mentioned the singlemost important reason some people have a constant battle - ie "medical". That alone is a huge topic (for other forums) that I don't want to go into here- but to make judgments and issue such bland statements about weight is pretty dangerous and insensitive.
Speaking of insensitive- clearly whether a certain Diva personally reads these blogs or not- she has certainly become aware of "them".
I'm sorry she has - only because it often goes beyond the level of spirited criticism and into the realms of sheer nasty vitriol and I'm just one who thinks when it does go over the top it demeans us all.
That being said- its a free world and I don't expect this post to change a thing because there are a lot of people who get off on such crap - and that's fine - go for it - but from now on, when you do, be prepared for me (and others who want to join me) to make the assumption that the conversation has reached the point where a change of topic is due.
There are a lot of conversations and topics I would love to pursue on here that we never get near so I'm happy to trade negatives for positives if others agree?
For starters- I share Baritenor's fascination with Mezzos - and one particular one in my mind at the moment, having been watching her DVD's of Macbeth and Samson & Delilah - Shirley Verrett. What an amazing artist she was- one of the few that could really ACT as well as sing. I wonder how many in here have actually seen her in performance? I think she's tops and by all accounts is a delightful person offstage as well as onstage.
Ms. Chanteuse - I can't agree with you more to be honest! I know that my writings tend to be verbose (it stems from my love of great literature like Melville, Hawthorne, Dickens, Carroll and the likes - and my dislike of simplistic authors like Steinbeck and Hemmingway *shudder*) and also because I like to be very thorough when I discuss things, partially in an attempt to give as few opportunities for misinterpretation.
La Divina Due - I like your posts alot as well.
There are plenty of fantastic coloratura's out there - dramatic ones at that. Aside from advertising friends of mine - the two most famous being Gruberova and Devia. I think it would also be good if Anderson got back into this repertoire and left Verdi and Strauss alone...surprisingly she has performed very little Donizetti and Bellini on stage or recording. She's one of my favs - her recording of Daphne is on the shelves now.
Steinbeck? Simplistic? *raises dukes*
Amerjaquino - this is one of the reasons I like to be very detailed when I write things!! Haha Yes, unfortunately, for my taste in literature...Steinbeck and Hemmingway both were far too simplistic in their use of the English language. Reading their works (despite the fact that I tend to enjoy some of Steinbeck's subject matter like 'Mice and Men') is like reading a children's book - I find their writing styles to be overly plain and boring - I like authors who utilize a wide vocabulary and write in an artistic, elegant manner. It's all a matter of opinion, of course!
His words are simplistic - everything else with him is rather complex
In fact, Hemingway was so simplistic he used only one "m." :)
Sorry, I really couldn't resist.
Haha winpal.
I'm very protective of Steinbeck I guess. Earlier this year I was in a production of Frank Galati's adaptation of 'Grapes of Wrath' which was pretty much the highlight of my career. Huge masterpiece, IMHO.
Well said Balbanov about Netrebko's overdarkened hooded sound, I agree with you entirely. I do hope she will remain for a while, b/c like Fleming, I do root for those 2 artist. I don't think there are 2 sopranos out there with more talent.
xvKIAV write more, thanks.
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Good job!
Hello all!
Please write anything else!
Magnific!
Thanks to author.
Hello all!
Please write anything else!
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Oops. My brain just hit a bad sector.
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Suicidal twin kills sister by mistake!